Dies und Das (2021)

[Fortis93]

2 hours ago, hal56 said:

I find that to be worded in an overly fatalistic way.

A VHS tape is better than nothing.

 

VHS?

 

[hal56]

vor 13 Minuten schrieb Fortis93:

 

 

 

 

 

I am not a friend of these half assed frame comparisons. U got to see it in motion.

Anyway, everybody is so hung up on pic comparison and totally overlooking one huge purchase reason.

The massive Atmos Audio upgrades 🤩

[Fortis93]

5 minutes ago, hal56 said:

I am not a friend of these half assed frame comparisons. U got to see it in motion.

Anyway, everybody is so hung up on pic comparison and totally overlooking one huge purchase reason.

The massive Atmos Audio upgrades 🤩

 

I agree, mate.

 

At the moment, it's better than nothing.

 

You have to watch the final product before you can make an informed judgment.

[Cornbuster]

vor 27 Minuten schrieb Fortis93:

At the moment, it's better than nothing.

 

What about Beauties?

[Blu Magic Ray]

 

.... bin wieder da ..

[Fortis93]

13 minutes ago, Cornbuster said:

 

What about Beauties?

 

[Cornbuster]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb Fortis93:

 

[Fortis93]

6 minutes ago, Cornbuster said:

 

 

Lasst uns gemeinsam trauern.

 

[Sir-Godric]

Hallo zusammen.

[Cornbuster]

vor 17 Minuten schrieb Fortis93:

 

Lasst uns gemeinsam trauern.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cornbuster]

@extantsrevenge

Nils, wir hätten neben der Beautyshotsorganisation noch eine weitere tolle Challange für Dich!!

 

Bald sind ja die 4000 Seiten erreicht!

Könntest Du bitte bis dahin die fehlenden 1000 Seiten noch rüberschaufeln?

5000 ist Pflicht - der Auftrag an Dich besteht ja bereits seit geraumer Zeit.

 

[BreakBeatDJ]

1 hour ago, hal56 said:

I am not a friend of these half assed frame comparisons.

 

I'm curious why you don't like these still frame comparisons.  When you color grade a movie, that is literally how you do it, you pull up a reference matched still and color/contrast match.  I think you can tell a lot about how a movie looks from the frame grabs.  It's clear one of the above is more contrast-y and saturated, the other has a far wider gamma and there's more detail in the shadows.  

Maybe I missed part of the discussion and what was being discussed.  Forgive me if so.

[Fortis93]

6 minutes ago, BreakBeatDJ said:

 

I'm curious why you don't like these still frame comparisons.  When you color grade a movie, that is literally how you do it, you pull up a reference matched still and color/contrast match.  I think you can tell a lot about how a movie looks from the frame grabs.  It's clear one of the above is more contrast-y and saturated, the other has a far wider gamma and there's more detail in the shadows.  

Maybe I missed part of the discussion and what was being discussed.  Forgive me if so.

 

I like these frame-by-frame comparisons because they provide some insight into what the final product will look like.

 

I know they're not perfect, especially because any perceived flaws in a still image may not be as noticeable or egregious in motion, or the images themselves may have been enhanced or doctored in some way by the person making the video.

[Gentleman]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb raylight:

 

Ich schaue mir in Zukunft genau an, was ich doppelt und dreifach kaufe. Da sind manche Fundstücke als "Pfannkuchengrundlage" wirklich besser als das, was die Studios selbst verkaufen. Und wenn man dann überlegt, dass die Studios die passenden Euros in der Hand hätten,um was Gescheites zu basteln, sind manche Ergebnisse am Ende einfach nur bescheiden.

 

Beispiel Avatar - UHD: leichter blau/grün Stich. Tiefenschärfe siehe linkes Gesicht beim Bart oder die Falten im Hemd. Generell etwas matt/blass.

 

UHD überarbeitet (regrade)

 

UHD: leichte Unschärfe, matt, blass.

 

UHD überarbeitet (regrade): schärfer, Flügel, Adern viel besser zu sehen, Kontraste stimmig.

 

UHD: auch wieder blass, leichter Grauschleier. Detail (siehe Hals) verschwimmen eher.

 

UHD überarbeitet (regrade): schwarz ist schwarz und nicht eher "dunkegrau". Schärfer, besserer Kontrast.

Siehe z.B. rechts bei den Reflexionen am Haar-Schmuck. Oder auch die Augen. Die Spiegelung im Auge viel intensiver und schärfer.

 

Nur mal so als Beispiel. Es ist sicherlich nicht alles "gold" was glänzt, aber das, was von den Studios teilweise kommt, geht einfach besser.

Das haben mir diverse Beispiele von anderen "custom regrades" bereits gezeigt. Ein Hoch auf die, die das draufhaben !

Würd ich auch gern können, aber mir fehlt die Zeit, mich in DaVinciResolve, Shotcut, Topaz etc. einzuarbeiten, leider. *seufz*

 

Heftig wie man so eine 4K von Avatar nur auf den Markt schmeißen kann! Unglaublich, dass das so durchgeht. Also wenn das wirklich so gewollt ist, dann trifft das hier so ziemlich genau zu 0% meinen Geschmack und ich bleibe lieber bei der Blu-ray! 😂

[Veum]

🥤🎬 🤠 🐴 🍪 🍩Top of the day to ya, going to be  ☁️  here my friends… good day there, Veum here❣️🙏  🙋🏻‍♂️

 

MON1/29

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Max UV Index1 Low

WindW 7 mph

[BreakBeatDJ]

28 minutes ago, Fortis93 said:

 

I like these frame-by-frame comparisons because they provide some insight into what the final product will look like.

 

I know they're not perfect, especially because any perceived flaws in a still image may not be as noticeable or egregious in motion, or the images themselves may have been enhanced or doctored in some way by the person making the video.

 

Ah got it.  So this is really an issue with the source and these analysis videos.  I missed that.

 

Calibration is a huge deal, and it is so difficult to know what is really there versus what you are seeing, if the calibration in the entire image chain is not correct.

Edited January 29 by BreakBeatDJ

[Gladiator_MV]

[Veum]

1 hour ago, Fortis93 said:

 

Lasst uns gemeinsam trauern.

 

 

1 hour ago, Cornbuster said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Fortis93]

17 minutes ago, BreakBeatDJ said:

 

Ah got it.  So this is really an issue with the source and these analysis videos.  I missed that.

 

Calibration is a huge deal, and it is so difficult to know what is really there versus what you are seeing, if the calibration in the entire image chain is not correct.

 

Well, I've seen arguments for and against these types of comparison videos.

 

A lot of arguments against them bring up the same talking points I mentioned earlier.

 

I sit somewhere in the middle. 

 

I think these videos give you an idea of what the final product will look like, but may not be 100% accurate.

[hal56]

vor einer Stunde schrieb BreakBeatDJ:

 

I'm curious why you don't like these still frame comparisons.  When you color grade a movie, that is literally how you do it, you pull up a reference matched still and color/contrast match.  I think you can tell a lot about how a movie looks from the frame grabs.  It's clear one of the above is more contrast-y and saturated, the other has a far wider gamma and there's more detail in the shadows.  

Maybe I missed part of the discussion and what was being discussed.  Forgive me if so.

Yes, but a single image is sometimes very misleading on how the movie looks in motion.

I saw many image comparisons were the oversharpened images looked way better and you became only aware watching the scene in motion

how terribly overemphasized/enhanced it looked and how good the supposedly weaker image was in motion.

Granted, a still frame might give you a good estimate how the movie was graded but it tells you nothing about how good it looks in motion.

[BreakBeatDJ]

7 minutes ago, hal56 said:

Yes, but a single image is sometimes very misleading on how the movie looks in motion.

I saw many image comparisons were the oversharpened images looked way better and you became only aware watching the scene in motion

how terribly overemphasized/enhanced it looked and how good the supposedly weaker image was in motion.

Granted, a still frame might give you a good estimate how the movie was graded but it tells you nothing about how good it looks in motion.

 

I agree with the last half of your last statement, but motion and color grading are not the same thing, as you know.  An image doesn't suddenly become more contrasty because it's in motion (the images aren't interlaced).  I personally have never seen a properly sourced still image from a scene, and then watched the scene and thought the grade was different.   You're right, if the still has been doctored, sharpened, whatever, then yeah, that's a different story, and it's completely useless.   You are also right, the overall affect is changed once you add motion, but not because the color grade is different or the still is wrong.  No colorist, myself included, would ever try to grade based on the moving scene, it would be impossible to get any consistency.  (Although you do correct for color bleed, chromatic aberration, lighting issues, etc via secondaries).  It is true you have to watch a scene during the process, but even color styles are held and applied via still frames.

 

I think that compression and output format make a big difference, and that is where motion can make things look differently from a still, if it's an inter-frame compression or not, and how it's handled.  But, we love our progressive scans, precisely because they are made up of non-interlaced still frames.

Thanks for sharing, it's an interesting topic and not one that gets talked about much : how a movie actually looks.

[Fortis93]

53 minutes ago, BreakBeatDJ said:

 

I agree with the last half of your last statement, but motion and color grading are not the same thing, as you know.  An image doesn't suddenly become more contrasty because it's in motion (the images aren't interlaced).  I personally have never seen a properly sourced still image from a scene, and then watched the scene and thought the grade was different.   You're right, if the still has been doctored, sharpened, whatever, then yeah, that's a different story, and it's completely useless.   You are also right, the overall affect is changed once you add motion, but not because the color grade is different or the still is wrong.  No colorist, myself included, would ever try to grade based on the moving scene, it would be impossible to get any consistency.  (Although you do correct for color bleed, chromatic aberration, lighting issues, etc via secondaries).  It is true you have to watch a scene during the process, but even color styles are held and applied via still frames.

 

I think that compression and output format make a big difference, and that is where motion can make things look differently from a still, if it's an inter-frame compression or not, and how it's handled.  But, we love our progressive scans, precisely because they are made up of non-interlaced still frames.

Thanks for sharing, it's an interesting topic and not one that gets talked about much : how a movie actually looks.

 

That's cool you're a colourist.

 

In your opinion, what do you think of the colour grading done for these James Cameron 4Ks?

 

Do you think there's too much of a teal push on them to make them look modern?

[Basil]

Can sort see this 4k motion argument bit like squirrels looking for beautyshots 🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

 

 

Basil 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[hal56]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb BreakBeatDJ:

 

I agree with the last half of your last statement, but motion and color grading are not the same thing, as you know.  An image doesn't suddenly become more contrasty because it's in motion (the images aren't interlaced).  I personally have never seen a properly sourced still image from a scene, and then watched the scene and thought the grade was different.   You're right, if the still has been doctored, sharpened, whatever, then yeah, that's a different story, and it's completely useless.   You are also right, the overall affect is changed once you add motion, but not because the color grade is different or the still is wrong.  No colorist, myself included, would ever try to grade based on the moving scene, it would be impossible to get any consistency.  (Although you do correct for color bleed, chromatic aberration, lighting issues, etc via secondaries).  It is true you have to watch a scene during the process, but even color styles are held and applied via still frames.

 

I think that compression and output format make a big difference, and that is where motion can make things look differently from a still, if it's an inter-frame compression or not, and how it's handled.  But, we love our progressive scans, precisely because they are made up of non-interlaced still frames.

Thanks for sharing, it's an interesting topic and not one that gets talked about much : how a movie actually looks.

 

Basically, thats what I was trying to say , but obviously partially failed. You are much more eloquent and on point so thanks for the explanations.

 

[BreakBeatDJ]

2 hours ago, hal56 said:

 

Basically, thats what I was trying to say , but obviously partially failed. You are much more eloquent and on point so thanks for the explanations.

 

 

Yeah, I'm sure we were saying the same thing . . . any chance I get to be a nerd and talk coloring, I go overboard.